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Old 11-17-2005, 07:41 PM   #61
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Originally Posted by gymeejet
in the fifties ? would they ever have been accepted ? i cant see how either of those 2 artists would be considered by the opry.
I agree completely with you in spirit. But if the sell-outs who run the GOO today thought they could get away with it, and there was a buck in it for them, they'd darn sure do it.
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Old 11-17-2005, 07:43 PM   #62
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isnt bill monroe the one that would jabber on many of his songs ? for me, that was a huge distraction. in fact, if i am thinking of the right artist, bill monroe was not really even the singer. he would just do these irritating "yee-haws" and crap like that. the only thing i disliked about bill monroe was bill monroe - the rest was actually quite good. but he would screw up every song for me when he started talking.

ernest tubb would do it once in awhile, but only as short intro's - like "here's eddie on the banjo", or something short like that.
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Old 11-18-2005, 12:34 AM   #63
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Originally Posted by gymeejet
isnt bill monroe the one that would jabber on many of his songs ? for me, that was a huge distraction. in fact, if i am thinking of the right artist, bill monroe was not really even the singer. he would just do these irritating "yee-haws" and crap like that. the only thing i disliked about bill monroe was bill monroe - the rest was actually quite good. but he would screw up every song for me when he started talking.
I thought you were a big fan of Bluegrass, Gymee.

Bill Monroe is the father of Bluegrass music. He did some, but not all of the singing on records and live performances with his bands over the years. Sometimes he sang lead, sometimes he sang backup.

He was a master of the mandolin, and was outstanding on the acoustic guitar and fiddle also.

Like a lot of performers, he probably did talk a bit during his live performances. That's common during live performances, and is the artist's way of trying to form a close connection with the crowd. In his recording studio material, I don't recall any talk.

His biggest hit was "Blue Moon of Kentucky", which he also did the lead vocals on. Elvis covered the song when he was at Sun Records. Elvis was a fan of Monroe.

Banjo legend Earl Scruggs first gained fame with Monroe's band in the forties.

Bill Monroe is one of only about five performers EVER, who is a member of both the Country and Rock Hall of Fame.
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Old 11-18-2005, 02:31 AM   #64
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hi rm,

yea, i do love bluegrass. and i recall liking the music.

bear family has the complete bill monroe collection, i think - i own all 3 sets.

i am trying to recall from memory, here.

i cant say that i listened to a lot of it.

perhaps it was even a live cd, that i was listening to - which i agree with you that that sort of stuff is enjoyable if you are at a concert, because it brings you into the performance. but not as a regular recording.

the cd i was hearing - i liked each song, and i liked the singing, as well. but then the leader would come in with a bunch of yee-haws, and totally mess up the atmosphere of the melody.

let me take the fifth on this, for right now. i can just recall being irritated at every song being messed up for me.

i was also a bit confused between whether it was a bill monroe cd, or a bob wills cd. did bob wills do that yee-hawing on his songs ?

i feel the same way with that dang-blasted steel guitar, when they play it slow, and instead of plucking it, they rub on it, creating the most irritating whine. i eliminated half of the kitty wells songs on the bear sets, because of it. roy acuff also has some of that sliding of the strings on the steel guitar. that sound is unmistakable to me - like fingernails on the chalkboard. LOL.

for me, the steel guitar is never a great sound for me, but i can deal with it, if it is mixed in with the other instruments. the fiddle can drown out almost anything, and i absolutely love that sound, along with the banjo.

i am sure glad that the steel guitar was one thing that left country music - and even lots of the old stuff doesnt have it. but there were some artists who used it a lot - but not all of them would do that irritating sliding of it.

i am not too fond of the hawaiian sound that they make with it, but i can at least live with that.

i dont know why they call it a guitar, anyways. it is a fairly large flat instrument - not like any other type of guitar that one is accustomed to seeing.

i guess i have whined enough for one post.
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Old 11-18-2005, 09:35 AM   #65
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Originally Posted by Renaissance Man
Some of my posts have been succinct, some have not. Not all of your posts have been succinct. But I have been noticeably more succint than Phil. I am responding to numerous posters in this thread, and if I have to elaborate a bit--get over it.

I'm not off topic. This thread basically comes down to this--Phil is very dissatisfied with Sirius's country offerings, particularly the Roadhouse. I agree there's room for improvement, but disagree completely with Phil's solution--which I would essentially equate with "killing the patient to cure him" or "throwing out the baby with the bath water". So Phil and I are debating how the Roadhouse should be formatted, among other things, which is on topic.

Never said that you did, so please stop being overly defensive. It makes you appear insecure. My post about the Nashville sound was FYI--since you and Prymel were both discussing the possible roots of the problem, and neither of you even mentioned the obvious root--the Nashville Sound.

They are two of the best known pop-country artists ever, and are well-known outside the country genre--so I was merely using them as examples. Get over it.

Most of your posts consist primarily of nit-picking about my form, rather than addressing my actual arguments and comments. So you need to heed your own advice about staying on topic. Get over your personal dislike for me, and debate the arguments, rather than acting like a close relative of the "Internet Spelling Nazi".
You obviously have a great passion for Country music and a rigid belief in what qualifies, for you, as Country. It seems to translate into a verbosity unmatched on this forum by anyone. Phil has one loquatious post (several long ones, but mostly lines of data) to your thirty garrulous ones.

You are off topic. Again, I urge you to start your own thread discussing what you want, instead of hijacking this one. I would enjoy participating.

You addressed your post to both Prymel and myself. How does responding to that make me defensive?

I neither like, nor dislike you. I don't know you. All I have to judge you by is your numerous querulous posts. Some of your posts are polite and interesting, if you agree with a post or a response to yours.

Please don't bother responding to this post. You've made your propensity for flaming quite clear. I will consider myself flamed. Please consider starting that new thread.
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Old 11-18-2005, 10:24 AM   #66
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Apologies for my part in the hijack to everyone. As is usual when discussing music, I tend to get a little strident & will run off on tangents.
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Old 11-18-2005, 02:53 PM   #67
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You obviously have a great passion for Country music and a rigid belief in what qualifies, for you, as Country. It seems to translate into a verbosity unmatched on this forum by anyone. Phil has one loquatious post (several long ones, but mostly lines of data) to your thirty garrulous ones.

You are off topic. Again, I urge you to start your own thread discussing what you want, instead of hijacking this one. I would enjoy participating.

You addressed your post to both Prymel and myself. How does responding to that make me defensive?

I neither like, nor dislike you. I don't know you. All I have to judge you by is your numerous querulous posts. Some of your posts are polite and interesting, if you agree with a post or a response to yours.

Please don't bother responding to this post. You've made your propensity for flaming quite clear. I will consider myself flamed. Please consider starting that new thread.
You're still off topic yourself, Mr. Ramius. This thread isn't about me, though you've made it so.

So please follow your own advice and stay on topic. If you're not satisfied with the direction of this thread, you are certainly free to move on to another one.
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Old 11-18-2005, 03:19 PM   #68
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Apologies for my part in the hijack to everyone. As is usual when discussing music, I tend to get a little strident & will run off on tangents.
There's certainly no need for you to apologize. You're certainly entitled as anyone to give your opinions. And contrary to the belief of some here, there's no unbreakable rule that says your comments must always stay rigidly in line with the thread-starter's initial post.

I just find it very odd that you don't consider Johnny Cash to be primarily a country artist. In his classic years, roughly 1955 to 1975, he was almost exclusively country.

He is in the Country Music Hall of Fame. He was a member of the Grand Ole Opry from the 1950's until his death. He has received numerous elite country music awards from the Country Music Association and the Academy of Country Music. Only two artists in history have had more songs that charted on the Billboard Country Music chart over the years.

He has been selected as "Country Music Artist of the Year" on several occasions, and has received multiple "Country Music Lifetime Achievement Awards" from major country music industry associations. He is revered in Nashville, the country music capitol of the world, by fans and industry people alike.

Just because he has dabbled with a few other styles over his long career, primarily in his later years---does not mean that he is not first and foremost a country music artist.
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Old 11-18-2005, 03:54 PM   #69
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Well, I would't worry about the repition for a while. Roadhouse is going to bumped for a while in favor of holiday music.
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Old 11-18-2005, 03:59 PM   #70
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Well, I would't worry about the repition for a while. Roadhouse is going to bumped for a while in favor of holiday music.
You're right.
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Old 11-18-2005, 09:03 PM   #71
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the number 1 charter, eddy arnold, was often ridiculed for making pop records, instead of real country ones. which i have to agree - he does have mostly a pop-oriented sound. but i still enjoy listening to him - although i dont think there is anything special about his voice, other than it has a pleasant sound to it.
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Old 11-18-2005, 10:06 PM   #72
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Originally Posted by gymeejet
the number 1 charter, eddy arnold, was often ridiculed for making pop records, instead of real country ones. which i have to agree - he does have mostly a pop-oriented sound. but i still enjoy listening to him - although i dont think there is anything special about his voice, other than it has a pleasant sound to it.
I agree he was primarily country-pop and easy listening. Definitely no Roy Acuff. Many of his record sales were to people who had no interest in country music.

I also agree his voice was pleasant but unremarkable. Perry Como, who was very popular in the easy listening category, is another famous singer who had a pleasant but unremarkable voice.
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Old 11-18-2005, 11:19 PM   #73
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hi rm,

lots of popular singers did not necessarily have a lot of vocal ability. if you were an easy listener singer, the most important thing was a pleasant sounding voice.

i like to listen to dean martin. but i am the first one to admit that his vocal qualities were extremely limited. he just had a very nice-sounding voice. i can still recall him singing a duet with kate smith on his tv show. i mean that took some guts. she had some range and volume, and could really let one go - although in deference to dino, she sang very low-key.

as i am getting more and more familiar with these old country singers, the same can be said of them. some of them have very limited voices, and were commercially successful because they were smart enough to stay within whatever niche that was both popular with the people, and doable by the artist.

little jimmy dickens, for example, is somewhat best known for his silly type of songs. but he had some real pipes on him.

if you enjoy yodeling, i have yet to hear anyone who can hold a candle to wilf carter. wilf usually yodels a whole verse when he does so, not just a little yo-he-who at the end of a song. but his most impressive yodeling is on some of his rifts. i dont particularly like to listen to it because he is no longer singing a melody - but even i can tell that that would be extremely hard to do - even for a good singer. he goes up and down, and all over town, and sometimes extremely fast - i can only think "wow".
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Old 11-22-2005, 05:34 PM   #74
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"lots of popular singers did not necessarily have a lot of vocal ability. if you were an easy listener singer, the most important thing was a pleasant sounding voice."

>>That kind of goes without saying. Their voices are pleasant and relaxing, but don't usually evoke strong emotions in their listeners. In other words, they're somewhat lacking in emotional depth.

>>However, there are exceptions to the general rule. IMO, Andy Williams and Johnny Mathis had noticeably more emotional depth than most of their contemporaries.

>>I would rank Williams and Mathis light years above Dean Martin or Perry Como.

"i like to listen to dean martin. but i am the first one to admit that his vocal qualities were extremely limited. he just had a very nice-sounding voice. i can still recall him singing a duet with kate smith on his tv show. i mean that took some guts. she had some range and volume, and could really let one go - although in deference to dino, she sang very low-key."

>>I never was a big Dean Martin fan. I only own one of his recordings, a "greatest hits" compilation. It primarily gathers dust.

"as i am getting more and more familiar with these old country singers, the same can be said of them. some of them have very limited voices, and were commercially successful because they were smart enough to stay within whatever niche that was both popular with the people, and doable by the artist."

>>A real "polished" voice isn't necessary in C&W, some would say it isn't even desirable. Real classic country hits you in your heart and gut. Real country boys singing "blood 'n guts" country that means something, beats some pretty boy from NYC singing fluff with a "slick" voice.
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Old 11-23-2005, 12:16 AM   #75
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hi rm,

most of the easy listening singers i am not as familiar with, other than their hits. i know dino had a very limited voice. i would not have necessarily said that about perry como - but then i cant say i have listened to him - i recall liking his hits.

i would definitely say that johnny mathis had some singing depth.

do you consider englebert humperdinck easy listening ? that is how i have him on my ipod. i think he has quite a bit of singing talent.

have you heard of guy mitchell ? i think he not only has a good singing voice, but i absolutely love his style of music (mitch miller and his sing-a-long stuff is way high on my list).

how do you classify bobby vinton ? i think his voice his pretty good.

what about tom jones' classification ?

i think i could come up with quite a few singers that i might tend to classify as easy listening, that did have quite a bit of vocal talent.

but as you said, obviously they have to have a pleasant sounding voice.

btw, have you ever heard wilf carter sing ? he was from canada, so lots of people have never heard of him.
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